The Health Care Debate - February 23, 1961
("Um . . I know this is a bad time but . . . .you're not covered.")
Note: This is a re-post from June.
The endless debate on Health Care. Every time the subject is brought up, screams of "Socialized Medicine" pop up - and somewhere, the ones doing the loudest screaming appear to come from the American Medical Association. Curious, that.
Case in point - this rather historic debate between Walter Reuther (yes, that Walter Reuther) and Dr. Edward R. Annis from the AMA from February 23, 1961. The gist of the debate centered around the Kerr-Mills bill, which had been introduced as an alternative health care plan.
Reuther: “And what bothers me, instead of being against all these things, instead of calling everything socialism, why don’t you sit down with other people and see if we can’t together find a practical mechanism?”
Annis: “Mister Reuther. . . .
Reuther: “Now the Kerr bill will not do the job, because only nine states come under the Kerr Bill. In the state of Kentucky they only provide, under the Kerr bill, three days of hospitalization. Now what happens at the end of that? Well, the person is either thrown on the indignity of the Public Charity or they’re pushed off to some poor farm. This is 1961. I think that’s not a rational sensible way to meet this problem."
The case for some kind of universal Health Care has been going on since somewhere after the Stone Age. Reuther, a staunch union man, makes the case for Universal Health Care. While Annis, a man with somewhat suspicious motives, is adamantly against it. Although he doesn't come right out and say as much, his argument is peppered with the buzzword "Socialized Medicine" and it's clear where his loyalties lie.
Needless to say, he was no supporter of Medicare when it came to light in 1964 and became law in 1965. He was also no supporter of the warning on cigarette packs saying it would be bad for business if people stopped smoking. But that's another story.
There is an interesting postscript at the end of this broadcast. CBS began a series of "Letters To CBS" and Smith reads some of the letters that poured in after the first hour of the debate from two weeks earlier. One writer, a doctor who chose to remain anonymous, supplied a copy of a letter allegedly circulated by the AMA to doctors, urging letters of condemnation of CBS and the concept of Universal Health Care as a step towards Socialism.
Even then, the fear card was being played for all it was worth.
TruthDig: The AMA Does Not Represent Us
When will government of the people, by the politicians, for the corporations perish from this Earth?
Not soon enough!
I'm all for getting rid of medicare/medicade. If elderly people won't allow younger Americans to buy into a public option, why should our money (the weekly deduction I see in my check) go to providing them with it? Let them buy their own health insurance and I'll buy my own. That way their 'death panel' will be the banker who oversees their bank account. "No money left, sir....I don't think that life saving treatment is within your reach. You can buy the pills, however."
What makes you think the "elderly" don't want younger people to buy into the public option? It is only those who are "bought and paid for" by the Republican corporate HACKS who are filling the town hall meetings and making the loud noise, so that it appears to be a large contingent of "elderly" people. Most of us are absolutely happy to "share the wealth." Or are "YOU" one of those trying to create that impression with "YOUR" words?
of post by the person saying that elderly people making his sick ... Are by a very sick person... These are the types of comments people make which sounds like a republicans and some independents... The independents which not to pay into government programs but love to use the benefits they receive..
They use the roads ,
the DMV ,
trash pickup ,
post office service ,
they are have the police 24/7 when they need them,
the fire department is available 24/7 ,
They have use our educational system and if they have children they will use it also (if they choice to have a private or a certain type of religious education then of course they will have to pay for it and if they still wish to use the public schools they can get the religious instructions for the place of worship..
Medicare insurance is 4 to 10 times "LOWER" then you private insurance.
If one has Medicare they will need other insurance to cover some of the costs which are not covered by Medicare and those insurances again will be an 4 times or more greater then Medicare and cover must lease of he burden..
But personally I do not understand why Obama does not make all three proposals available to the Americans which will use it and let them decide what they believe they wish to do...
Obama and the democrats especially the ones which are siding with the corporate republicans and receiving funds from this health empire are defeating them selves and their credibility by not making this health reform transparent and available to the people who are paying for it and will be effected by it..
None
Here's another one:
http://www.pnhp.org/news/2009/june/the_ama_do...
After the National Security Act of 1947 all avenues of propaganda were used to point out the evils of 'Socialism' in our midst.
This was and is part of the program for Perpetual War.
Everything the Oligarchs touched was used in this propaganda machine. The movies, television, advertising, anything to spread their anti social message.
The propaganda has worked and continues to work.
According to this world view, you are a consumer, not a citizen. You have no responsibility to other citizens, you are only required to consume.
---
Amy Goodman at Truthdig; Congre$$, Heal Thyself here
---
The Perpetual War continues to this very day. $100 Billion for more war:
here
statusquObama, change you can only pretend in
Any solid Father would consider you a visionary child... I appreciate your incitefull and rousing entry's....Paul
and the health care is exemplary, contrary to what you hear down here.
Change is always scary for people. I was just a kid when healthcare became universal here in the 1960s, but I remember the fierce debate surrounding it.
It would be great if some Canadians who were part of its implementation could talk to Congress or the US media. Americans need to hear all sides of the story.
If you've seen "Sicko" you know that was one of Michael Moore's inspirations. Have an _American_ who sneaks into Canada talk about their health care, an _American_ who has an accident in London talk about their health care, and a bunch of expats(although that's pretty darn suspicious, hmm?) talk about their health care in Paris.
and am planning to move here so I don't have to deal with one more go-nowhere healthcare boondoggle and the ensuing lack of insurance.
I'm an artist and an artist friend here in Germany just had to prove through newspaper clips or recordings that he's a real musician supporting himself as such and he's now getting national health insurance that pays most of his bills. The process from application to acceptance took....24 hours.
Once I'm settled in here I so look forward to not wasting any more of my precious minutes thinking about the evil assholes who pretty much control the USA. I say pretty much because if progressives got off our asses (instead of leaving the country for example) we could effect some change, but that ain't gonna happen any sooner than the regressives will take to the streets with their guns--in fact that's much more likely to happen.
A strong middle class in the USA means people of all colors and ethnic backgrounds getting money and political power; the racists/classists/militarists who have 95% of the power aren't going to let that happen, I really think that's why Repugs always do their best to impoverish the middle class--as far as they're concerned, the white folks who get dragged down into poverty (in smaller %s than the non-white middle class) are an acceptable cost of keeping the non-whites "where they belong."
Sorry to go on at length but this is my first post on any blog I belong to saying sorry fellow progressive Americans but here's one of us who's given up on any real change happening. Obama either played us or didn't know what he was up against.
Good luck, you're all going to need it!
Excellent article here:
http://www.commondreams.org/view/2009/06/16-4
I'm calling my Congressman here in The Berkshires, Rep. Olver, tomorrow to find out the timeline on the voting. My understanding is that they will be voting in July?? If true there is little time for us to push Conyers 676, which in my opinion is the ONLY legislation worth voting for.
We need a massive CITIZEN LOBBYING EFFORT at the local district offices of these Congresspersons.
I'm contacting Physicians For A National Health Plan (supporters of H.R. 676) to see how we can organize town meetings in all the 435 districts ASAP in order to select our own representatives to go to the district offices to lobby all on the same day with a major media publicity campaign. Local Senate offices would be visited as well.
If necessary, I feel it is time to do these meetings en masse and choose 7-10 "locals" (preferably doctors and nurses) to "sit-in" until the Congressperson comes around to what THE MAJORITY DEMANDS!!! I believe it would be particularly powerful if we had doctors and nurses doing the visits. After all, we are the ones who deliver health care in this country and we ought to know what will work and what will not.
Access to health care is a human need, not merely a "want". It's a matter of life or death.
We are demanding to have the same quality health care as THEY receive, including dental and vision and long-term care.
Enough is enough! We've waited long enough for all the "stars to align" (Democrats controlling The White House, House and Senate).
I believe it is now or never that we all put on our "citizen" hats and leave the "consumer" hats in the closet!
Abbybwood, R.N. (Ohio, Florida, California and New York)
"The US has an army of 90,000 soldiers in Afghanistan and is spending $100bn a year, but has still been unable to defeat 20,000-25,000 Taliban who receive no pay at all." - Patrick Cockburn
I'm tired of posting on blog after blog about my own, and many other Canadians' experience with our single-payer/Universal Healthcare (call it what you will) and how I would never trade it for anything else anywhere.
I think it's a great mix of things (nothing is so simple), but the one thing I hear throughout all of the discussions & arguments about healthcare reform in the U.S., is just plain 'fear'. Fear of something new; fear of admitting that the age-old 'American' system just doesn't work; fear of labels...labels that the self-serving pocket-liners have been feeding the afraid for generations.
Time to realize that you do not live within this superior bubble that will 'right itself' given enough time...time is up...it's never going to happen. Those rich & powerful that the American populace at-large seem to be so enamoured with are never going to allow the everyday people to have any rights or privileges other than what they dictate.
Sounds extreme...well, no...I'm just amazed over & over at how the people of the U.S. continue to allow themselves to be manipulated.
I live in a country amongst people who are very much like you.
As far as healthcare goes...I never take my wallet when I go to my doctor (whom I chose & when I chose to have a different one...no problem), nor to the hospital, nor to the walk-in clinic.
There is no 'middle man'...I cannot even fathom having someone in a corporation somewhere having 'any say' as to my personal healthcare!
In my 58 years, I have had numerous procedures, tests, surgeries, physicals & even treatment for lymphoma. I have never experienced an unreasonable wait time, I have always had the best of care, by doctors & nurses, in the best & most up to date hospitals. When I was diagnosed with lymphoma just two years ago, I had consultations, tests and therapy all within two months of said diagnosis...yes, all done within two months...and luckily clear to this day.
My experience is not unusual...it is the norm here.
Tell me about the stories you hear...use your head...anyone anywhere can come up with exceptions to any rule...we're dealing with humans...never will there be perfection...there will always be some dissatisfied people.
But the distance between what I have available to me here & what you put up with is extreme...and even now you are being denied the option of even talking about a system that has been working here for generations.
Tommy Douglas was the founder of our healthcare system...he, of course, met with great opposition when he put his ideas forward.
Well, Tommy Douglas, in this decade, has been declared the 'Greatest Canadian' by the people of Canada. Yes, he beat out Wayne Gretzky, Terry Fox, Pierre Trudeau & Alexander Graham Bell!
The main reason...his introduction of our healthcare system.
I write all of this because I am so sad that one of the great countries doesn't have what is so within their power to institute & that is to look after their own people for their most basic needs...I fear that it will never happen.
For your cogent testimonial.
If only every American could read your words, I really believe it would make a difference.
I hope you don't mind my sharing your post with a few people tomorrow? It's one of the best I've read yet on the Canadian system of healthcare.
Abbybwood
"The US has an army of 90,000 soldiers in Afghanistan and is spending $100bn a year, but has still been unable to defeat 20,000-25,000 Taliban who receive no pay at all." - Patrick Cockburn
Very well said.
to both of you...I do appreciate your comments.
I just can't imagine how you all must be feeling, living the situation, and knowing how I feel, just being a bystander.
Abbybwood...if you think it might help in the least, please feel free to use my comments wherever & to whomever you would like. I am flattered, but...
I wish that words could make a difference, but reading all of the wonderful bloggers, who are the true journalists of our time, and all they have researched & put out there...it just seems to hit a brick wall with too many people...and never seems to make any impact on those who wallow in their own celebrity & advantage.
I'm not sure why I feel so strongly about this...it just seems so wrong & has become such a circus...when really it's simply about looking after people's basic needs...and so unnecessary considering what the U.S. says it stands for.
Peace & good luck.
Lsamsa
Yes, the public option is a slow death for private insurance companies. Sad truth is, some things need to die for new life to arise. Without the Black Plague, Europe wouldn't have had the Renaissance. The technology of the time couldn't sustain a growing population. The monster that is private health insurance prevents new industries from arising. Citizen takeover accountable to voters, not shareholders. And the next time someone cries socialism, know these three words, Green Bay Packers. No Greedy owner demanding a new a stadium or new luxury suites. The same frozen tundra played out in the 50's gets played there today. Socialism works fine for the Green Bay Packers. At least that's my understanding, correct me if I'm wrong.
single payer plan, investors would have more opportunities because health care could be 1/3 of what it costs now. That would put more disposable income in the pockets of consumers and create a better economy which would benefit the investors. Why can't they see this. Wake up you wealthy elites that sit at home collecting those dividend checks. Wake up the pension and 401 plans that are supposed to be looking out for your investors. Wake up Wall St who should also be looking out for the long term investors.
Why don't we call it as it is, and then firmly stand by it??
I'd like nothing better than indeed Socialized HealthCare. Knowing that I'll get the care I need when I need it.
Social. Community. Everybody.
What's so bad about it?? Compare 'Socialized HealthCare' to 'For Profit HealthCare'.
Which sounds better???
My Father-in-Law recently had a hip replacement operation, just last week in fact. He has med-ins through the Teacher's Union, don't you know that his private insurance rejected his claim for rehab! Why?! Because he walked about 50ft, with assistance, to ensure that his hip was in fact working and he could be discharged from the hospital. Some for-profit insurance bureaucrat determined that his MD's recommended course of rehabilitation after a major joint replacement was unnecessary. Medicare said "how much time do you need?"
Rethugs talk about some "government bureaucrat" making your medical decisions for you. Never mind the fact that this happens all the time, right now.
Profit should not be a motivating factor in determining health care. I'd rather not have some Insurance Medical Director (who may in fact be a doctor) with no familiarity or actual knowledge of my case making decision about my health based upon the fact that if they deny enough people they get a bigger bonus at the end of the year. No company should be permitted to profit from medical treatment. Hospitals and insurance companies should all be non-profit, just as police departments, fire departments and public schools are.
End of line...
... it is that unlike most professional associations, which tend to promote efforts to expand enrollment in the field (in fact, that is one of the motifs behind the conception of the first professional/trade associations), the AMA has in fact conducted a campaign for the longest time aimed at keeping an artificial shortage of medical doctors in the US of A.
In many western countries (esp. in the EU) where college education tends to be heavily subsidiced by the state, they actually have the opposite problem: too many MDs graduating, thus there is a fierce competition for doctor positions. Whereas in the US there are not enough MDs, that is why the insane 36+ hr shifts are common place.
Only in the US of A would make sense to have a person who has been working for more than 8 hrs straight to be in charge of a patient.
The funniest part about the AMA, is that they are usually the first ones to complain about socialized medicine using the excuse of how much doctors in this country have to work, and how socialized medicine would diminish their pay and thus affecting the care they provide. Where in reality, they are one of the main reasons why doctors have such insane workloads in this country, and doctors in socialized systems make comparable salaries as their American counterparts... in fact they may end up making slightly more money, because they don't have to pay as much in terms of loans (medical school in this country, even state schools, costs a pretty penny let me tell you) and the insane policies that American doctors have to buy in for medical malpractice insurance.
I don't think the AMA has ever supported the medical profession, as much as they have been interested in defending the "health management" profession... which is something completely different.
What fucking debate are you talking about? There is no debate, the washintonians have closed the debate to anyone but them and private insurers. So for us, the people, the debate is over. Yeah Obama!!!!!! Thanks for the fucking change!!!
I really appreciate all the comments and the observations on this issue. I think we can all agree the problem goes a lot deeper and for a lot longer than we are lead to believe. I posted an earlier piece from 1948 where the AMA was again complaining about Socialized Medicine. So this issue has been going on for a very-very long time, which means any useful change is going to take a miracle. Those of us who freelance, who are not on a company health plan are truly screwed, paying over $1k a month for health care with a $5k deductible. It almost makes more sense to dump the coverage and head to Mexico when I get really sick. And how ironic is that?
Thanks again for your support. I'll keep digging up stuff over the next few weeks.
...unfortunately, America has missed its chance to ride it and is doomed to certain destruction.
Good-bye and good riddance, stupid Americans.
Are to the private sector what the Pentagon is to the government only they are directly paid their trillions in cash by the customer instead of having it laundered through Washington. You didn't really think they were gonna just roll over for their love of humanity now, did you?
Here are the two versions of the Health Care Bill.
You can read them for yourself…
The simple Medicare for all plan:
HR 676
http://www.pnhp.org/docs/nhi_bill_final1.pdf
The 1000 pages with loopholes plan:
HR 3200
http://energycommerce.house.gov/Press_111/200...
Actually there are 5 versions that have been passed out of committees and one other version still stuck in the Senate Finance Committee. None of these versions include HR 676; however, Rep. Waxman said Pelosi would allow a vote on the house floor to substitute HR 676 for HR 3200. I am not sure if or when this will actually happen. This is crucial to where Democrats need to seize this opportunity to turn the tide.
I support HR 676. The more people say we don't have the votes, the more I want to fight and prove them wrong.
Even though it was the postwar Labour government that set up the National Health Service in 1948, when Britain was commited to spending that much post-crisis restructuring money (and you should be emphasizing that too if this is going to get through), it was the following Conservative administration that presided over and funded its growth, development and expansion, along with the building industry boom, back when the idea of full employment still seemed attainable. All this was done for the sake of new jobs and economic stimulus, and the Conservatives weren't to leave power again until 1964. The slogan "you've never had it so good" didn't come from nowhere.
having to fire a single shot in the public and right wing.
This excerpt is from an article titled "Reply to Critics of Bait and Switch: How the Public Option was Sold"
http://pnhp.org/blog/2009/08/08/reply-to-crit...
By early 2009, it was clear the Hacker-HCAN-Herndon Alliance propaganda for the “public option” and against single-payer had worked with the Democratic leadership, and that the Democratic leadership would fall once again for a market-based alternative and remove single-payer from the table. The removal of single-payer legislation took place without the firing of a single shot in public by the insurance industry and the right wing. It took place at the request of the “yes but” wing.
In the House, single-payer legislation, HR 676, has been rammed back onto the table, thanks to hell-raising by the single-payer movement, including the arrests of some brave doctors and nurses who disrupted hearings in the Senate Finance Committee last May.9 [Article left out Rep Weiner forcing the issue in committee] Last Friday night, Speaker Nancy Pelosi agreed to allow a floor vote on whether to substitute HR 676 for HR 3200, the Democratic leadership’s “public option” bill. This is a significant victory for the single-payer movement, but it should not have come so late in the 2009 session. If Pelosi and the three committee chairmen who wrote HR 3200 had permitted HR 676 to go through the normal committee hearing process, single-payer advocates would have had more time to educate Congress and the public about why a single-payer system is superior to all other alternatives.
It appears almost certain that the reform cycle we’re in now will end the way the last two did – with the Democrats’ competition-based alternative to single-payer going down in flames. It is extremely important that progressives, especially progressives in the “yes but” camp, understand why this happened. Yes, the ultimate villain in these dramas was the insurance industry and their conservative allies. But universal coverage advocates must understand the role of the “yes buts,” and the policy entrepreneurs they listened to, in splitting the universal coverage movement and in seducing Democrats to support legislation that was no more likely to pass than single-payer legislation and wouldn’t have cut costs if it had passed. If they don’t see this – if they persist in believing the insurance industry is the only force single-payer advocates have to contend with – they will, wittingly or unwittingly, help perpetuate the pattern we have seen in the last three reform cycles. They will, in short, perpetuate the insanity of doing the same thing over and over, seeing it fail, and not learning from failure.
I just listened to a very good, a very fair piece on the Canadian health care system on NPR.
http://www.npr.org/templates/player/mediaPlay...
Several things that
1. A Canadian with color cancer gives his praise on how he has been treated....everything has gone "bang, bang, bang"; "nothing but good"; "no out of pocket expenses";
2. All Canadians covered; can see any doctor anywhere. No co-pays or deductibles.
3. Not all services are covered, such as optometry, dentistry ...and, yes, some do struggle to pay. But private insurance is offered (and many buy it) to cover things like this.
4. Report says that the Canadian system is not one of "socialized medicine"; rather, it is "socialized insurance," where the risk is pooled together. Delivery of health care is private, where doctors run their own businesses. Physicians earn a good living; they aren't faced with the same administrative hassles doctors here are.
5. Yes, a small number of patients go to the US for health care, but these are very rare visits. It's like when someone gets struck by lightning...."it's extremely rare, but when it happens, everybody talks about it."
There were many other points....but take a look...it's well worth listening to to help dispel the lies that are being spread about that Canadian socialized health care system!
1. A Canadian with color cancer gives his praise on how he has been treated....everything has gone "bang, bang, bang"; "nothing but good"; "no out of pocket expenses";
Not true. In many places you now have to pay fees associated with some treatments. For instance, need crutches? You have to pay.
2. All Canadians covered; can see any doctor anywhere. No co-pays or deductibles.
Not true at all. If you have no family doctor, you are screwed, except for emergency visits at hospital. And good luck at finding a new family doctor if yours decides to run for the border to the US where the cashola is mighty fine. Two of my sisters have been without family doctors for going on 8 years now, with no doctor willing to accept them as patients. Emerg service only, or crappy health clinics ran by med students.
3. Not all services are covered, such as optometry, dentistry ...and, yes, some do struggle to pay. But private insurance is offered (and many buy it) to cover things like this.
True. Drugs aren't covered either, unless you are on social assistance or retired on a government pension.
4. Report says that the Canadian system is not one of "socialized medicine"; rather, it is "socialized insurance," where the risk is pooled together. Delivery of health care is private, where doctors run their own businesses. Physicians earn a good living; they aren't faced with the same administrative hassles doctors here are.
True. Doctors are treated as upper class citizens, sometimes earning 10 times the average income of their patients. Many places are now paying their school tuition, buying their homes, etc, to entice them to move where there are shortages. Usually works temporary, as they almost always end up moving to where they'll make more $$$.
5. Yes, a small number of patients go to the US for health care, but these are very rare visits. It's like when someone gets struck by lightning...."it's extremely rare, but when it happens, everybody talks about it."
True. Rich people are dense.
It may not all be true, but I found it at least to be in contrast to the scare tactics Republicans are using about "socialized" medicine, long wait times, etc. The report admits some problems, but basically says that those problems are not nearly as bad as being reported here.
It also illustrates something else about the "problems" the Canadian system may or may not have. Both sides, but notably the opponents of Obama's plan, use individual anecdotes to "show" how bad the Canadian system is. For every example opponents can give, I bet you can find another example that supports those in favor of Obama's plan. I've used my own example in support of Obama's plan....when I lived in Europe, I had absolutely no problems with getting to a doctor; friends with serious illnesses got right in for treatment and were cured. In my point number 1 above, it sounded to me as if what that particular patient was true, at least for him. About paying for crutches, that sounds like it goes into item 3.
As far as item 2, I guess I do not know; but how many Canadians are covered, compared to here? Are you saying that for those who do have coverage, can they not go to any doctor anywhere? Is the problem of finding a family doctor wide spread? I have seen reports here lately that finding family doctors, or any doctors for that matter, is a problem here in rural areas. I also understand that each province in Canada has its own system, its own network, so that problems in one area are not necessarily widespread throughout the entire country.
My firm belief is that the opponents of universal health care in this country are greatly overblowing the problems that exist in Canada and other "socialist" countries.
every system has problems, and honestly, I would not trade you this system for the US system of Greed Inc. ever.
In the last 10 years or so, the province I live in, has been attempting slowly, to change the healthcare into America's Jr Healthcare project. The system works good most of the time, except the people at the top of the healthcare foodchain suck the money out of the system before it goes where it is supposed to. Even in a small town, a hospital CEO paperpusher, can make more than 300 grand a year easily. But when it's budget time, it's always the nursing that gets the layoffs, close the beds, sometimes complete floors of hospitals.
We have a serious healthcare vulture problem, and it has slowly been eating away at our system.
BTW, I love the terms being tossed around in this whole debate. Socialism, blah, blah, liberal, blah, blah. It's all BS. Canada is no more socialist than the US on anything. Corporations still make obscene profits in everything including healthcare. It's nothing more than a friendlier system. I cannot imagine a nation anywhere that asks patients for their bank account before treating them. Too bizarre.
Well, CC, I think you've hit the nail on the head....greed. It's sickening here that one of the biggest opponents of fixing the problem here is one Rick Scott with Conservatives for Patients Rights. His former company, HCA, was fined $1.6B for fraud; Scott never was charged, and he says that the fine was levied after he left HCA; but the fact is, the charges of fraud were made while he was running that company.
It's sickening how much these executives make....yes, that's what capitalism allows you to do....but it's unethical, immoral to make so much filthy money off of someone's misfortune of illness and disease.
300 grand for a hospital CEO paperpusher....wish I made that much, whether that's Canadian or US dollars!
The Ontario government publishes online, the CEO pay of every hospital online. I used to have the link, but got so angry I deleted it. Most of these people are nothing more than vultures, but make huge coin to "manage" a system that they have no right to be involved in at all. Most are not even doctors. Just paper pushing dimwit political cronies. So, anyone that says that lobbyism isn't alive in Canada, is a liar. Every major government run agency in Ontario is ran by a political crony. It sickens everyone.
BTW, CC, I also am sick of this "socialist" crap...really sick of it. That term is thrown about as if it were bad and evil. You hear people quote the phrase "life, liberty, and the pursuit" of happiness when they think we might be going socialist on them.
I lived in "socialist" Europe for 4 years. My "freedoms" were every bit as strong as they are here. I lost no liberties in Europe. You can eat whatever you want; you can buy and drive cars if you want; you can buy a home and live where you want; you can vote in free elections; I've seen massive protests...these happen even against the government; you can see any doctor you want (they are not assigned to you); you can start a business of your own (as a matter of fact, a good friend of mine from St. Louis also worked with me in The Netherlands.....she stayed behind in The Netherlands and started her own business there....that's right, an American started a business in The Netherlands).
And these people just throw that term "socialism" about, as if it is evil, and apply it towards health care reform. Makes me sick.
Same as the mantra of a "liberal" politician. Who are they? Where? The percentage is so damn small that it is barely noticeable. There are no liberal politicians. Hell, here there is even a Liberal Party, and nobody sees the hypocrisy of these greasy buggers calling themselves liberal at all. They aren't.
If that were Sarah The Victim Palin, aka Sarah The Quitter, laying on that bed after big Insurance dropped her for a pre-existing condition of yeast infection she didn't disclose back in the 1980's, she'd be the first one screaming for guvment run health care to come save her ass.
Sounds like sarah doesn't know her pud from her bud.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
For years, Max Fine has been advocating a single-payer program, similar to Medicare. Washington hasn't been listening.
Why should Congress (and the rest of Americans) listen to Mr. Fine? Why should his opinions be considered?
Max Fine probably knows more about what it takes to put together an viable government-run health care program than anyone alive. He is the last surviving member of President Kennedy's Medicare Task Force. These were the people who created Medicare, and presented the program to President Johnson.
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